Setting up a Woody – Q&A

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This topic contains 2 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  andy__reilly 3 years, 11 months ago.

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  • #51711

    jp
    Participant

    Thought i should publish a recent conversationon setting up a wooden firefly, got me thinking about adding to Mark’s guide.
    The mast gate measurement is i believe the critical piece of the puzzle not covered in the original measuring.
    Happy to answer more questions too.
    Please chip in if you have different approaches.

    the article refereed too is in the technical information link in About the Firefly, on the left

    Cheers,
    Jono
    ______________________

    Hi Jono,
    When I was listening to you Ben Vines and Tony Thresher talk about your boat you said you set it up like another boat, I was wondering where you got the measurements from ? so I could have a look at them.
    Thanks

    Jono Pank
    bloodhound – well – ish….
    i looked at all the measurements that Mark tait had collected in 2008 & then looked at which one i felt was quickest & also similar to my boat in terms of where the centreboard bolt is.

    Alexander Baxter
    okay

    Jono Pank
    Pauls seemed a little out of sync (the CB bolt is quite different to mine & i think he’s chnaged the mast foot position since too), mark taits boat is very different, so i chose bloodhound as a benchmark and worked from there.

    Although the key item i used is the measurement of the front of the mast gate as far back as possible

    Alexander Baxter
    where did you get the numbers from?

    Jono Pank
    firefly website – there are a set of measurements from Torbay 2008 of a few boats, all are quick,
    huds is plastic, so you can discard that for the sake of this conversation.

    Alexander Baxter
    haha yes very true

    Jono Pank
    so – there isn’t one to copy – it’s not that simple.

    Alexander Baxter
    Yes very true, I think I will compare with Bloodhound as that’s a Mark 1A as is mine and will be more similar, hopefully

    Jono Pank
    you have a set of ranges there
    1st check CB bolt to transom – check you’re there or thereabouts
    then add the two measurements of bolt to transom and bolt to mastfoot together
    then measure from the transom, running under the bolt to the mast foot – range on the three wooden boats is no too vast. That should give you a good starting point on the mast foot pins.

    here’s my approach though.
    front of mast gate on max aft
    set the tolerance on the gate (8mm movement) with mast in then measure your rake.
    look at mast rake (5)
    with the mast against the back of the gate
    aim to be in the range (which is 114-116) – measured how mark suggests
    adjust the mast foot pins get it in the right place

    by the way – your mast gate may need chocking at the front and then the retainer will need to be Spaced back accordingly

    Jono Pank
    last part.
    once you have the mast in the right place, then set the shrouds finger tight when the mast is sitting against the back of the gate.
    look up the shrouds and look for “no” deflection
    either in/out or fore/aft

    Alexander Baxter
    in heavy wind is there any point in altering that ? to depower

    Jono Pank
    how light are you?

    Alexander Baxter
    well that depends on my crew but usually around the 18-20 stone mark

    Jono Pank
    you could go up one but we got it wrong at the champs and were up two by accident and had no power and poor pointing etc
    you’re in the right weight range so i won’t bother

    Jono Pank
    use cunningham / lots of main halyard tension etc
    we were 21.5 last year, more this looking to be back at <22 for next.

    You can pull the board up a bit – i used to do that when i sailed light with Sally wilson

    Jono Pank
    mark your board where it has moved from the Front edge vertical to the back edge being vertical – makes a big difference to change that balance
    i.e. turn the boat on it’s side and move the plate back/up – then mark it on the top of the board that shows above the case

    Alexander Baxter
    yep
    do you want front or back edge vertical upwind (I’d think front?)

    Jono Pank
    Front till overpowered, then swing it back
    Try it, it has a big impact

    Alexander Baxter
    How much Cunningham do you use ?

    Jono Pank
    Only when overpowered and hanging on, then as much as as it keeps getting windier. None till.
    Less this year than last! But that was our rig cockup

    Alexander Baxter
    okay, and also I was speaking to Guy Davison and he uses a lot of kicker. How much do you use

    Jono Pank
    Lots
    16:1 and pulling it hard at times. Though it doesn’t come in till I can’t hang onto the main sheet anymore. Use sheet tension as long as possible. When you sheet the mast sits against the back of the gate, once you more to kicker, the mast bends and pushes against the front of the gate, so it’s quite a big transition, if it’s constant – then it’s ok, but in puffy stuff i think it’s better to hang on and avoid the kicker as long as possible. rob Sherrington makes a good point that once you start pulling the kicker, you feel like you want more jib halyard too – which you do – so you need to know that you’re going to stick with it before you start messing.

    Alexander Baxter
    So once you’ve got your mast and shrouds set up right, what do you set the jib tension off of.

    Jono Pank
    Tricky that….. I don’t know!

    Alexander Baxter
    ahah, its the joy of sailing firefys with the slot so close

    Jono Pank
    I’ll have a think how to measure that one.
    I used to think that in light/med conditions i’d be looking for an inch of jib sag from the forestay (the forestay is held tigher on elastic though, it doesn’t hold any tension as such)

    Alexander Baxter
    well myself and Guy Davison set it off of the forestay as a loose setting and the once it looks right put some markings on the boat

    Jono Pank
    Depends where your jib sheets are located. Mine are back
    Agree with that approach on the tension.

    Alexander Baxter
    I agree with your reasoning on the jib sheets being back.
    Did you work out where to put them yourself or take them of off bloodhound
    it also varies on where your thwart is

    Jono Pank
    Judging by the measurements, bloodhounds are well forward.
    I kept them where they have always been on pogie.
    I’ll see if i can find the measurement!

    Cheers,
    Jono

    #53738

    Guy
    Participant

    I was expecting something entirely different in the answer JP, maybe I misunderstood the subject you appeared to be addressing…. Ask Sarah if you are still puzzled. Frances cried with laughter when I read out the subject.

    #62307

    andy__reilly
    Participant

    Is there any differences for the settings between an older short rig and the new taller rig? I can imagine that the jib fairleads would be fractionally further forward but are there any other changes people have noticed?

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